On a Failing of History

"Nauraushaun" (nauraushaun12) 01/31/2020 at 17:33 • Filed to: None

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The use of sheet metal for car roofs.

Let me hit you with this: like the use of sedans where wagons are just better, and the whole SUV fascination, the idea that a car roof should be sheet metal is a mistake.

Your car has plenty of sheet metal. The stuff above the belt line is there to keep you un-mangled in the event of a rollover, why have any more than you need?

If you can’t clearly make out the frame of the top half of your car, you are doing it wrong.

Why have the metal? Have glass, or takey-outey-panels. Plastic if you like. Windows front, side and rear are a start, but not enough. A sunroof is a step in the right direction - the bigger the sunny part , the bigger the step.

If you don’t want openey bits, make it part of the doors. Give them some glass, some flair. But do something.

I’m not talking about convertibles. They throw it all a way, the body lines, the shape of the roofline. They’re cheaters at best, ugly at worst. They’re specialized - you give a lot up for a convertible. I’m talking about regular cars - all of them.

Life and motoring are about more than boring ass sheet metal sections.

Post more examples of framey bois that perpetuate this half-cocked opinion. Maybe stay off the Japanese sports cars, I’ve gone a bit far with them already.

Kiltedpadre > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 17:42

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Am I doing this right? How much has to be gone to go from framey boy to convertible? Full window frames and a top brace close enough or one step over the line?

pip bip - choose Corrour > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 17:45

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Triumph TR4 and Porsche 911

ranwhenparked > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 17:45

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Counterpoint: roofs are also for weather protection, and not having extra potential failure points where water could leak through is a valid concern.

Plus the structural weight and rigidity issues

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 17:47

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It’s difficult to tell as the tint makes it look black in most pictures but the XJ22 0 has a glass roof.

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 17:54

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BMW 335i GT has a really nice glass panel roof they made them through 15 I think.

Jim Spanfeller > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 17:59

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Does the Ford Skyliner count? It’s a hardtop and a convertible, so you get actual roof styling when you don’t want the car to be open to the elements.  Or if you don’t like that, there’s also the fabulous glass-roofed ‘56 Crown Vic:

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 18:05

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Yeah! A proper car roof should be made of striped cloth!!!

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 18:19

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Honda did this with the JDM CRX. Not all of them tho.

CaptDale - is secretly British > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 19:00

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Why not be able to take the roof and the back glass out?

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 19:12

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Counterpoint on convertibles: what if the execution of the convertible is so iconic that it becomes recognizable in its own right and outlives the model it was based on by a full decade?

Brian, The Life of > My X-type is too a real Jaguar 01/31/2020 at 19:16

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My F31 has that roof and I love it

My X-type is too a real Jaguar > Brian, The Life of 01/31/2020 at 19:38

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My Father has 14 335i GT, it has it and is it great almost makes me think I should have gone that route instead of the F10 535i manual I bought.

MiniGTI - now with XJ6 > Kiltedpadre 01/31/2020 at 22:06

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Good answer

DipodomysDeserti > My X-type is too a real Jaguar 01/31/2020 at 22:09

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Same roof on my wife’s X1.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > Nauraushaun 01/31/2020 at 23:16

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Counterpoint:

I live in a place where the sun is an oppressive force of woe assaulting your good sense and better judgement six months of the year. Something that blocks all transmission of that upon my hide from above is  a good thing.

Nauraushaun > My X-type is too a real Jaguar 02/02/2020 at 15:06

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Is not bad, gets a pass. I suppose it’s almost just the boot section that’s not glass, but who wants a sunroof there right?

Nauraushaun > ranwhenparked 02/02/2020 at 15:09

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These things are true, but also true of any car with frameless windows. Road cars make all sorts of compromises to performance in the name of fun and luxury, what’s a few more?!

Nauraushaun > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 02/02/2020 at 15:09

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This is a whole different world but I’ll take it. dam

Nauraushaun > Jim Spanfeller 02/02/2020 at 15:11

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The first is too much sheet metal, or sheet whatever that is.

The Skyliner with the glass roof gets a pass. Though the whole thing should be glass ;)  

Nauraushaun > If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent 02/02/2020 at 15:12

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True! I’ve always thought that was cool. Though IIRC there’s no sun-shade whatsoever, which is brutal.

Nauraushaun > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 02/02/2020 at 15:16

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Hnnng that’s so cool. And with that mirror finish you only get in certain 80s Japanese cars.

Nauraushaun > pip bip - choose Corrour 02/02/2020 at 15:16

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yes yes

Nauraushaun > Kiltedpadre 02/02/2020 at 15:16

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I think this is a bit far and more of a sign of general British incompetence than anything else.

But that a side it’s a solid pass.

Nauraushaun > CaptDale - is secretly British 02/02/2020 at 15:17

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Exactly! There are only a handful of cars that let you remove the rear glass. Why not more!? Why not ALL!?

Nauraushaun > I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker 02/02/2020 at 15:17

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Is that so? I did not know. I guess it gets a pass, but it’s a different kettle of fish.

Nauraushaun > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com 02/02/2020 at 15:18

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I think this is an important factor. Down in Melbourne we get the blazing Aussie sun, but not too often and much of the year it isn’t that warm.

On the cold days, the greenhousing of glass is fantastic. Car is always warm. On the warm days having the roof open is great. If it’s too hot, you’ve got sun shades. It works.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 16:01

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It’s got a heavy tint, and how often does Britain have a ho t sunny day anyways? The glass roof works for the market it was designed for.

Jim Spanfeller > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 16:45

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Well, I had included the first one because you complained that convertibles with the top up have no roof styling; so I showed you a convertible which does have a styled roof.

Nauraushaun > If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent 02/02/2020 at 20:34

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Haha, I guess so.

And its long range capabilities are so...dubious...It’s unlikely to make a trip say from England to sunny Italy

Nauraushaun > Jim Spanfeller 02/02/2020 at 20:34

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Ah yes. And right you are. All the lines of the hard top, conserved

Jim Spanfeller > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 20:42

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And from a practical perspective, you can’t slash it, it lasts longer, the rear window is glass, it would be quieter... Other than the fact that it weighs more, you basically get the best of both worlds. Hardtop convertibles are cool.

Jim Spanfeller > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 20:56

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Chicks and ducks and geese better scurry
When I take you out in the surrey,
When I take you out in the surrey with the fringe on top!

Specifically, the 1900 Columbia electric surrey car.

Jim Spanfeller > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 21:01

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Fiat Jolly?

Jim Spanfeller > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 21:03

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Roadkill’s backyard Buick temporarily had a unique solution:

Jim Spanfeller > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 21:28

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Bentley Continental SC. Not only is there a removable roof panel, but the back part has a sunroof!

Jim Spanfeller > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 21:32

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Do landau roofs count?

Nauraushaun > Jim Spanfeller 02/02/2020 at 21:37

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Totally! I’m a big targa/t-top fan. I’m all about hard top convertibles.

However they come.

Better insulation from the elements too.

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > Nauraushaun 02/02/2020 at 21:39

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Yeah, it’s a weird one. For most markets, the Mk1 Golf only went til 1983 (1995 for Yugoslavia I think, then all the way to like 2009 in South Africa, but the Citi Golf is a different animal). The Cabriolet got a couple different faces. I have an 86 big bumper single headlight car, but I’m pretty sure they could be had with small bumpers and quad headlights, or with the Clipper body kit as shown above.